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Shocked

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Shocked

Postby Ally » Wed Jul 11, 2007 5:23 pm

This is quite a personal topic and one that I have never discussed with anyone on this forum......

OUr son (master 8 ) has been having learning difficulties at school and as such he has undergone a speech pathology test & a Central Auditory Processing Test. The SP test revealed that he has some learning difficulties and was suggested he had the further CAP test done...the CAP test revealed that he has a signifigant problem with his auditory memory.

To give a bit of an overall picture he often gets into trouble at school for doing naughty/silly things in the classroom....his teachers told me that they felt that his behaviour was because of his learning difficulties, that he was feeling the effects of not being able to keep up with the work....when the results of the CAP test came back I went to see his teacher to see what was going to be put in place for him in the classroom...I was told that it would not be discussed with me until I went back to the referring doctor....I was quite cranky at this as I felt he had been poked and proded around enough and thought we had gotten to the bottom of the issue....Un-beknown to me his maths support teacher had written a letter to the referring doctor, completely changing what I was told about his behaviour....she now claims that he is impulsive and un-cooperative...(can anyone else see where this is going???) so we went to the doctors today and have walked out of there so bloody out raged!!!!! I have never been so angry in all my life as hands up what the doctor has now concluded that he has ADHD I mean WTF is going on???? The ONLY solution that she can see....we need to start him on ritalin immediately.....Am I the only one who thinks that this is a load of total and absolute bollocks??? She starts to do up the prescription and we said no....her reaction was unbelievable telling us that there is absolutely NO side effects to this drug, it is the safest and only way to treat my son!!! I told her what the school said to us and that this is exactly the opposite of what she has been told and she just over road us and told us again that ritalin is the ONLY way to treat this problem.....we upped and walked out and needless to say the censored fight is just about to begin with the school........

I cannot believe that doctors are just so quick to hand out this drug like candy....one thing for sure is that it will NOT be passing our sons lips!!

Sorry for the rant.....but it was either type a long and venting message or eat the remaining block of dark macadamia chocolate that Scott bought on the way home!!!!
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Postby kate_turner2000 » Wed Jul 11, 2007 5:57 pm

hey ally i am disgusted. working in childcare i personally have seen the affect of add/adhd drugs on kids. these days its overdiagnosed and drugs are overprescribed. if a child has learning difficulties they MUST have add - what a load of bull! instead of the school sitting down with you to work out a behaviour change plan and take adequate steps to try and improve your sons behaviour (in conjunction with home and school) they simply see it fit to refer the matter to a doctor to prescribe drugs. seems to me like the school is trying to wipe their hands clean of your son and his problems learning instead of getting to the nitty gritty facts that they cant handle his behaviour or discipline him in an appropriate manner.

seek a second opinion ally. if you were the mother of an adhd child YOU would know it. and we would hear about 'he is doing this or he did that'. another link to poor behaviour is food and we all know that you feed your kids wholesome foods so he isnt going off the deep end from the sugar, preservatives, additives, colouring etc etc.

let us know what you decide to do. i am fuming and i wasnt even there!
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Postby Playboy_bunny » Wed Jul 11, 2007 6:40 pm

Those Lazy Stupid Pr*cks that call themselves teachers! :evil: That is ridiculous...seems like its easier just to wash their hands and say 'he has ADD' then they dont have to look at their own teaching methods! That is just bloody wrong...people use ADD as an excuse waay too often these days its just ridicilous.. Definately fight this Ally, If they are lying (or giving false opinions, whatever you want to call it) that is NOT ON, not for you, not for your son.... its not fair for him to be labelled and given medications that are not needed (or suitable) for his situation..Kate is absolutely right, Ally get second opinion for sure...You would know if your boy had ADD...other than that all I can say is (((HUGS))) and fight it all the way :evil:
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Postby Roar2Life » Wed Jul 11, 2007 6:46 pm

Hey. I don't have kids (god i'm still a kid myself :lol:) but I agree with your decision to refuse ritalin. I think medication should be avoided unless it is really necessary. I know medication is often the only choice for some conditions but I believe behavioural conditions like ADHD (which it really sounds like your son DOES NOT HAVE) should be controlled through discipline with medication only being used in extreme conditions.

I fully back Kate's suggestion of a second opinion. Explain to the new doctor what has happened and asked that he be re-assessed. In regards to the school I would approach them asking why they told the doctor different information about your son's behaviour to what they told you. If you are unsatisfied with their response and their general attitude, perhaps it needs to be looked at whether changing schools would be beneficial. I know it's hard to change schools (i've done it a few times myself) but it's even harder staying at a school where they are not reaching their full potential. Some schools have specialised support programs in place for children with learning difficulties and some teachers specialise in teaching children with learning difficulties. When I say specialised I mean they are willing to put in the effort to have your child 'fit in' and reach his full potential. They are the teachers who spend hours at home brainstorming ideas of how to best help your child's needs.

Good luck and let us know how you go. :)
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Postby Butterfly_Dawn » Wed Jul 11, 2007 7:01 pm

as far as I know (we recently had a speaker on ADHD) for ADHD to be diagnosed, ratings of behaviours indicating ADHD MUST be present in ratings from 2 sources of the child's life (usually home and school, since that's usually all the kid's life revolves around). I would definitely be going to another doctor, perhaps with a specific training in ADHD with a good rep and explain that you are NOT seeking a diagnosis flat out, just want a double check. Maybe even take him to a child psychologist - ADHD is a psychological disorder and psychologists are trained to assess and diagnose psychological conditions but do not and can not prescribe (only doctors and psychiatrists can do that), although they often work in conjunction with doctors who prescribe if/when required.

FYI I seem to remember the speaker we had did touch briefly in question time on some research which is finding links between ADHD use and increase in later behavioural problems such as aggression. He believes (somewhat paradoxically) that actual ADHD is under-diagnosed, but that the diagnostic process is being misused so that it is overdiagnosed in the general population (in other words kids who have it are being missed and kids who don't have it are being misdiagnosed as having it)
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Postby milkyway » Wed Jul 11, 2007 8:23 pm

What the hell is the maths support teacher doing contacting your family doctor :shock: ? Was this teacher part of the testing process?

I think you have every right to feel outraged, Ally, and definitely go and see a second or third doctor.
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Postby Mandie » Wed Jul 11, 2007 8:53 pm

That's awful Ally!!! I'm as outraged as everyone else on here... it was wrong of the teacher to contact the doctor (rather than you) and wrong of the doctor to try to force ritalin on you.

For the record - a lot of kids DO have ADHD. And a lot of those benefit from ritalin, or dexamphetamines. These drugs do have side effects, as do all medications, but when used appropriately, for the right children, they can have impressive results.

However - as somebody else mentioned above, it doesn't sound like your child fits the criteria for ADHD. The diagnostic criteria include symptoms like impulsiveness, poor attention, easy distractibility, difficulty with school work, being "on the go as if driven by a motor", difficulty waiting in turn, and so on. The DMV IV and ICD-10 (classification systems for psychiatric disorders) BOTH state that these symptoms must not occur in the presence of another medical/other condition that could also cause them. That is, if a child with a known learning disability has trouble doing his homework, that is NOT a symptom of ADHD, but rather a symptom of the learning disability. All of your son's symptoms could be caused by the learning disability, and his resulting self-esteem and difficulty with school.

Also, as was also mentioned above, the criteria specifically states that these symptoms must be present in TWO domains - e.g. home and school. The doctor didn't listen to you when you said he was okay at home, and just barrelled ahead with her own diagnosis - this is wrong! Parents know their children best, and one of the most important things a doctor can do is LISTEN to the parents - LISTEN to the mother who says her baby is "not herself today" , because she might be seriously ill and not just sleepy, as she appears to you. LISTEN to the parent who says their child is out of control at home. If your child had ADHD, you would not be denying it - you would be begging your doctor for a treatment!

I rambled again. In summary - your doctor did the wrong thing. Absolutely get a second opinion. And I would be writing a formal letter to the school, and arranging a meeting with the teacher concerned and the principal to discuss exactly why what they did was wrong.

Best of luck with your son Ally - it's a challenging time for any parent to discover their child has a learning disorder, not to mention having to deal with all this CENSORED too!!
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Postby Chelle » Wed Jul 11, 2007 10:47 pm

That is wrong Ally that a teacher are very quick to judge that it is ADDHD where it could be just a simple learning difficulty, if they just did there job & teach kid's or spend a little bit more time on your child if he is not understanding somthing other than judging without a medical opion is wrong, they are teacher's not doctors. They think as soon as there is a problem it must be ADDHA & they don't want anything to do with the kid in there class. Deffinately get a second opion, as your his mum you would know if he has it or not.
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Postby zeedeveelgirl » Wed Jul 11, 2007 10:49 pm

Oh bl00dy doctors *(#$& I've had it up to here with them lately!
Sorry to hear your doctor is being so narrowminded, Ally!!! I'd definitely seek a 2nd opinion, because as everyone says you'd definitely know it if your kid had ADHD!! That's ridiculous that the teacher wouldn't even speak to you til you'd seen the doctor. Talk about passing the buck!!!!
Let us know how you go with it - don't give up!!!
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Postby shokoden » Thu Jul 12, 2007 1:24 am

Hey Ally my eldest daughter 10 has auditory memory problems recently diagnosed too, she has the reading and writing capabilities of a 7-8 year old. The schools that she has been to will not keep her down as they dont do that anymore. This child is now in year 5 and is way out of her depth. I spoke with her teacher and she said that there are about 5 other children in the class with learning disablities too, I believe that it has a lot to do with how they teach the children to read and write these days. Bring back the Phonics system i say! I stipulated on the first meeting with the paediatrician that i would not be medicating her if it was to come to that hence no prescription. We have been taking her to a tutor who specialises in children with learning difficulties and although she has only been going for 1 term can see visible results with her reading and writing already. If your son is being disruptive in class it is probably alot to do with the auditory memory and he is probably feeling frustrated not keeping up with school work and acting out because he needs help. I hope you dont think i am butting in or making assumptions as he is your son and you know him best.
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Postby shokoden » Thu Jul 12, 2007 1:30 am

Sorry Ally i forgot to mention that we also had out daughter tested for ADHD/ ADD but we had to fill out a form rating her behaviour on certain tasks eg does she fidget alot blah blah blah her teacher had to fill in the same form also as did the doctor when he assessed her. You should have at least been involved in the process.
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Postby yummymummy » Thu Jul 12, 2007 12:43 pm

It all sounds a bit weird the way you teacher and Dr have decided your son is ADHD, the girls have given some good advise. I recommend getting a referal to a peadiatrition and getting hin looked at thouroughly, then with a diagnosis getting an action plan in place for him which can be done thru your GP this will give him some speech therapy, psyc management and what not.
My 4yr old has multiple learning probs- they have mentioned ADHD to me but the paeditrition told me we would have to see him a few times to have that diagnosed as he would like to see Riley more than once before diagnosing. He gets weekly speech therapy, occupational therapy thru the public health system and is reveiwed regularly by the school psycologist. Its been a hard couple of years and I know Ive got a few more trying ones ahead of us, its so hard and sad to have to discuss my childs problems with people.
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Postby SarahC » Thu Jul 12, 2007 1:33 pm

Hi Ally. I don't have a whole heap of knowledge about adhd, but it seems like every second kid gets diagnosed with it, whether they have it or not. I personally think it's an excuse for bad teaching... not bad learning!! If teachers knew how to teach and engage their students then there would be less supposed adhd cases!

I had a similar thing happen to me in the Navy. I was given my medical records to take to an off-site medical appointment. They were sealed with the assumption being that we would not open it. Of course I couldn't resist and had to have a read through and find out what was being said about me. Anyway, in amongst the documents I find a letter from my instructor detailing all of my supposed behaviours in the classroom :shock: I was sooooo annoyed (well, livid actually, to the point of physically shaking!) I ripped out the page and tore it up (bad move as I destroyed the evidence in my harassment complaint against the instructor :roll: ). Next thing I'm being referred to a psychiatrist to be assessed for depression and being prescibed funky anti depressant drugs. I refused to take the drugs because, besides the fact that I couldn't go to sea if I took them, it was an new kind of experimental drug and the side-effects were "unknown" :shock:

I don't blame you for not wanting to give your son drugs especially since they are not needed. Is there someone you can complain to re the teacher's communications with your doctor??
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Postby yummymummy » Thu Jul 12, 2007 1:59 pm

Hi Ally. I don't have a whole heap of knowledge about adhd, but it seems like every second kid gets diagnosed with it, whether they have it or not. I personally think it's an excuse for bad teaching... not bad learning!! If teachers knew how to teach and engage their students then there would be less supposed adhd cases!

Ive got to disagree on this point- my son has had a great teacher and Ive spent soo much time an energy with him dealing with his out there behaviours I could teach the super nanny a thing about controlling behaviours and being consistant, but he is still struggling to gain a basic kindy education because of his inability to concentrate for longer than 2 seconds, although there is probably some misdiagnosed kids out there (as with any illness) its usually really hard to get your child diagnosed with ADHD, thats why Allys story is so strange, Ive been told a GP cant diagnose ADHD they have to have further assessment to get this diagnosis its not an easy way out Trust me!!
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Postby yummymummy » Thu Jul 12, 2007 2:00 pm

Man I never can quote stuff I was ment to quote sarahs words not mine!! oops
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